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INU Regional Legislature

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76 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:43 pm

I understand the point that the INUCA is for passing legislation, but we should still maintain the power check provided by referenda; this would allow laws that were poorly met by the people to be repealed if necessary without having to wait a few more months for the next INUCA. And, furthermore, if a party controls the INUCA, it essentially does control the government; if the SC vetoes their laws, they can override the veto. The delegate also doesn't do much in passing any sort of law, so it would be irrelevant if they held the delegacy at that point. About your past experiences, I can obviously only speak for myself, but the referenda we managed in the IWU went smoothly and easily; we never had trouble with them. Lastly, even if the people have a right to make proposals to repeal things, the law would have to be pretty bad for them to get the motivation to write a full proposal against it. It also serves as motivation to the INUCA to pass laws for the benefit of the people.

But, as this is extremely important to decide, we'll hold another referendum on this.

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77 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Thu Oct 10, 2013 5:13 pm

And, furthermore, if a party controls the INUCA, it essentially does control the government; if the SC vetoes their laws, they can override the veto.
I thought that was the whole point of the large required majority to repeal a veto?

Lastly, even if the people have a right to make proposals to repeal things, the law would have to be pretty bad for them to get the motivation to write a full proposal against it.
They might just disagree with it.

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78 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:09 pm

For the first part, if the party has that much control over the INUCA, they could handle the large majority. Especially if they had a similar opinion to another party in power.

For the second part, my point was that the proposal wouldn't pass if the law wasn't just a little bad. Over half the region would have to dislike the law enough to overlook the benefits of it and vote against it. This means that a law passed by the INUCA would only be successfully repealed if it was indeed that bad.

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79 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:11 pm

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--Do we agree that we should form a legislature?
An intergovernmental body would probably be a good idea.

--What will we call the legislature?
"General Assembly" sounds about right – it's for general purposes and it's an assembly.

--How many members will make up the legislature?
Well, there's two approaches here:
1) One nation = one member = one vote. (Alternatively replace 'one' with another number but otherwise this number would be equal amongst members.)
2) EU-style: Accord legislature members to nations based on population. That's slightly unfair however and I'd be against that.

--What duties/authority will the legislature have?
Most definitely, an international legislature should not legislate members' internal policies. If a member nation wishes to comply with regional legislation then so be it, but it shouldn't be forced.

However, international relations between members and possibly other areas would be the most important mandate of any international body.

--What vote percentages should be used for the given duties?
I would wholly recommend business be conducted on the 'majority of a majority' basis: i.e. a majority of members would constitute a quorum and majority of those voting in the affirmative would be sufficient to pass legislation.

--How would elections for this be carried out?
I would say that, if each nation has a single representative, each nation would decide the means by which that representative would be decided. If we went for the EU-style different members, different representative numbers then a coordinated cross-borders election would probably be the need there.

--How often would elections for the legislature be?
I'd say every third month (OOC anyway).

80 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:39 pm

@Northumbria: We're actually doing each one of those points one by one. We're currently on "How would elections for this be carried out?". The vote we are conducting now is to decide on a disagreement, and after that we'll resume with the discussion and finish up everything. The vote finishes tomorrow evening, if I'm not mistaken.

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81 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Sun Oct 13, 2013 7:25 am

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Ah I see. So could somebody brief me on what has been decided so far? Smile

82 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:15 pm

@Northumbria: There's a lot to cover, but I'll go over the basics for you. We obviously agreed there should be a legislature. We named it the INU Congressional Assembly (INUCA). We will start with an elected 20% of the regional population (rounded to the nearest odd number). Gradually, as the population grows, we will lower the percentage down to 10%. The INUCA's duties are making/repealing laws and amending the constitution, and vetoes by the Supreme Council can be overridden. To pass a new law, a 55% majority is required. To amend the constitution (which includes repealing laws), a 75% majority is required; to override a veto, an 85% majority is required.

Right now, we are deciding how to carry out elections. Here is the idea I proposed (with edits):
--INUCA elections would occur every 4 months.
--An INUCA election would begin exactly two weeks prior to the beginning of the new term.
--Prior to the beginning of each election, the chairman would telegram the leaders of political parties with a notification for the parties to begin selecting their nominees.
--Each political party could produce a maximum number of candidates equal to 85% of the number of INUCA seats. Non-party residents could nominate other non-party residents (political parties are only recognized by the government once they reach 5 members; those in parties with less than 5 members would be listed as non-party).
--For elections, there would be a 1-week nomination period and a 1-week voting period.
--For voting, each voter would list out the candidates he or she wants in a telegram to the chairman.

Other ideas and modifications to this one are welcome.

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83 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Sun Oct 13, 2013 2:21 pm

What is the Supreme Council?

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84 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Sun Oct 13, 2013 9:04 pm

The Supreme Council? It's essentially the executive position in our government. Rather than a president or another sort of single leader, we have a multi-person council instead. It's listed on the INU's World Factbook Entry.

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85 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Sun Oct 13, 2013 9:14 pm

I'm pretty happy with your suggestion for INUCA elections, so I'm going to throw my weight behind that.

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86 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Sun Oct 13, 2013 9:41 pm

Zwotstyg wrote:The Supreme Council? It's essentially the executive position in our government. Rather than a president or another sort of single leader, we have a multi-person council instead. It's listed on the INU's World Factbook Entry.
Oh, okay. Thanks.

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87 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Sun Oct 13, 2013 9:45 pm

Zwotstyg wrote:Right now, we are deciding how to carry out elections. Here is the idea I proposed (with edits):
--INUCA elections would occur every 4 months.
--An INUCA election would begin exactly two weeks prior to the beginning of the new term.
--Prior to the beginning of each election, the chairman would telegram the leaders of political parties with a notification for the parties to begin selecting their nominees.
--Each political party could produce a maximum number of candidates equal to 85% of the number of INUCA seats. Non-party residents could nominate other non-party residents (political parties are only recognized by the government once they reach 5 members; those in parties with less than 5 members would be listed as non-party).
--For elections, there would be a 1-week nomination period and a 1-week voting period.
--For voting, each voter would list out the candidates he or she wants in a telegram to the chairman.

Other ideas and modifications to this one are welcome.
I pretty much agree with everything here, except I don't think it's necessary for nominations and elections to take a week each. I would say three days for each is the most time necessary without wasting some, tbh.

Also, I think voting should be transparent (people would post their votes openly on the forums or the RMB so everyone else can see), because otherwise it opens up the possibility of abuse.

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88 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Sun Oct 13, 2013 11:30 pm

@Othelos: I would be willing to shorten the voting period; three days is plenty of time for everyone to get on and send a telegram. However, the nomination period needs to be long so that parties have time to sort out their nominees and organize themselves for the actual voting. The nomination period should remain about a week long, in my opinion.

About the second part, I personally don't mind posting a vote, but other people seriously dislike allowing anyone but the counter to see their votes. As long as everyone is responsible in voting for a good chairman, we shouldn't have problems with them cheating on the votes. It's possible, but I feel confident that everyone here is trustworthy. Perhaps in the future we could discuss two chairmen, so that votes could be verified.

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89 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Sun Oct 13, 2013 11:51 pm

Zwotstyg wrote:@Othelos: I would be willing to shorten the voting period; three days is plenty of time for everyone to get on and send a telegram. However, the nomination period needs to be long so that parties have time to sort out their nominees and organize themselves for the actual voting. The nomination period should remain about a week long, in my opinion.
That works. So sort of a compromise? 3 Days for the election and a week for the nominations.

Zwotstyg wrote:About the second part, I personally don't mind posting a vote, but other people seriously dislike allowing anyone but the counter to see their votes. As long as everyone is responsible in voting for a good chairman, we shouldn't have problems with them cheating on the votes. It's possible, but I feel confident that everyone here is trustworthy. Perhaps in the future we could discuss two chairmen, so that votes could be verified.
I'll cautiously trust your judgement, since I haven't been here long enough to form an opinion on everyone.

However, I do think that if abuse does become a problem or there are clues of it (not necessarily with the chairman and counting votes), we should discuss more transparent ways of running certain parts of the government and other preventative measures. Until something like that happens, it's not an issue so I guess it doesn't matter.

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90 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Mon Oct 14, 2013 8:27 am

Othelos wrote:
Zwotstyg wrote:@Othelos: I would be willing to shorten the voting period; three days is plenty of time for everyone to get on and send a telegram. However, the nomination period needs to be long so that parties have time to sort out their nominees and organize themselves for the actual voting. The nomination period should remain about a week long, in my opinion.
That works. So sort of a compromise? 3 Days for the election and a week for the nominations.

Zwotstyg wrote:About the second part, I personally don't mind posting a vote, but other people seriously dislike allowing anyone but the counter to see their votes. As long as everyone is responsible in voting for a good chairman, we shouldn't have problems with them cheating on the votes. It's possible, but I feel confident that everyone here is trustworthy. Perhaps in the future we could discuss two chairmen, so that votes could be verified.
I'll cautiously trust your judgement, since I haven't been here long enough to form an opinion on everyone.

However, I do think that if abuse does become a problem or there are clues of it (not necessarily with the chairman and counting votes), we should discuss more transparent ways of running certain parts of the government and other preventative measures. Until something like that happens, it's not an issue so I guess it doesn't matter.
I'm inclined the agree with Othelos here, I'd love to see a system of transparent voting happen sometime in the future.

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91 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Mon Oct 14, 2013 8:55 pm

I myself have no problem with transparent voting; we can indeed hold a vote on that when we feel it is necessary. As long as everyone else isn't iffy about the idea, I'm certainly not against it. I just want to make sure that the voters have their decision on the system they'd like to use.

As nobody has presented opposition or alternatives to the proposed election plan, we will proceed with the discussion.

We have now reached the final section: how long should an INUCA term be? After this, we officially have our plan for the INUCA, and we will be able to implement it once we are prepared.

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92 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Mon Oct 14, 2013 8:57 pm

I suggest a four-month term. This period actually goes by much faster than you would think, and it allows the INUCA adequate time to do its work. Furthermore, it means that ordinary elections and INUCA elections would only intersect once a year (assuming we move the ordinary term up to three months from the current, temporary two-month term).

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93 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Mon Oct 14, 2013 9:47 pm

Four months seems like a good idea.

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94 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Tue Oct 15, 2013 1:14 am

Eh? I thought we already discussed this? Oh well, I'm still inclined to agree with four months.

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95 Re: INU Regional Legislature on Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:24 pm

As nobody else has proposed an alternative, we will use an INUCA term of 4 months.

This discussion, then, is now complete! I thank everyone for their participation and ideas; we put together quite a lot of material from this. A legislature is an important component of a government.

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